Media ID 0210-B (LGRRC #29)
Tonight Show talkback (ca 9 March 1985) just after the Homosexual Law Reform Bill was introduced into Parliament (8 March 1985)
Fran Wilde, Norm Jones, talkback callers, unidentified speakers
Poor radio reception – improves a bit. I think this is the old Radio New Zealand “Tonight Show” broadcast nationwide from Wellington. However the tape states it’s Radio Windy (I’m not quite sure then why there are adverts for Wanganui)
This summary gives general themes as to the content of this recording. It is not a verbatim transcript. Always refer back to the original audio. This is a working document and any amendments/corrections are welcome.
Tonight Show talkback (ca 9 March 1985, broadcast from Wellington and relayed on River City Radio, Wanganui ?)
Introduction to talkback on the Tonight Show
The Homosexual Law Reform Bill was introduced into Parliament on Friday..
Fran Wilde – the Bill has two major objectives – decriminalisation and anti-discrimination
Wilde – I put it forward at this time .. Venn Young’s Bill.. things have changed considerably in ten years..
Norm Jones – I’m against any homosexual law reform.. the only people wanting this are the homosexuals .. normal people.. sodomy or anal intercourse.. we’ve got crisis after crisis in this country.. this will pass unless the public of New Zealand speak out..
Caller: Claire – I’m dead against this law.. giving young children the freedom to do what they want..
Wilde – age of consent .. sexual orientation set very young in life.. protection for children under sixteen..
Caller: Claire – parents have got it hard enough now.. this Bill is disgusting..
Wilde – in any population there is always a certain percentage of homosexuals..
Caller: Jack – this Bill is ridiculous.. how’d you like to be a parent with four kids.. and the two daughters walking in on the two boys.. you might as well bring in prostitution..
Norm Jones – this Bill is even worse than you say it is..
Wilde – the Bill doesn’t allow incest.. bringing the law into line with the law for girls..
Jones - a sixteen year old can have sex with a twelve year old.. We don’t allow a father to go to bed with his daughters..
Jones – boy / boy is abnormal..
Caller: Peter – Norm Jones, you’re the typical thick cocky from Invercargill .. you’ve got the thing out of context..
Wilde – AIDS and Homosexual Law Reform.. I’m concerned about a public health campaign where some may not participate because they are defined as criminals.. it’s not a homosexual disease.. closet gays in New Zealand..
Jones – In the US 300-400 known cases.. contamination through gay bars.. group sex.. it’s only been in its epidemic stages because of decriminalisation.. it will become a new vogue of living.. AIDS legally transmitted..
Caller: Ethel – what does Fran Wilde hope to achieve..
Wilde – I would find it very difficult if I was permanently considered a criminal.. good or evil..
Caller: Ethel – After the war I worked for the London police force.. I saw a whole town’s children ruined because of homosexuality.. If you legalise these things.. the priest had been interfering with the choir boys..
Wilde – protection for children.. homosexuality and paedophilia are two different things.. most child molestation is due to heterosexual men..
Caller: Mike – what they do is up to them.. they’re not hurting anyone.. once it’s law I’m not going to go and pick up some bloke..
Jones – homosexuality is learnt .. cultivated.. it’s abnormal intercourse between men..
Wilde – there’s no evidence as to how homosexuality develops
Jones – we’re talking about twelve year olds
Jones – history should have taught us something.. everywhere they’ve got into the community .. those civilisations have gone down the tubes.. they should have treatment.. they are certainly sick.. gut feeling that it’s unnatural.. psychological treatment.. the ultimate sin.. I want to see Church leaders come out against this Bill..
Caller: David – 3 questions, is sodomy a perversion, if Fran’s two sons became homosexual.. and homosexuality in pigs..
Wilde – I’d like my sons to grow up secure in their sexuality.. I wouldn’t put him in a hospital for treatment.. attitudes are much harder to change than the law..
Jones - I know half-a-dozen homosexuals.. I wouldn’t go to bed with them.. I have a certain distaste and bigotry.. I don’t know any lesbians.. Bruce Beetham’s idea to make lesbian acts illegal
Caller: John – offer support for Fran Wilde.. I’m gay.. why should they be persecuted.. I haven’t been persecuted.. age of consent.. equality..
Wilde – I’ve met a lot of gay men that have been discriminated against.. main stream churches have come out in favour of reform
Jones – individual judgement day
Wilde – 51 voted for the introduction of the Bill.. correspondence.. Heylen Poll gave a majority for reform..
Jones – only three Labour Members voted against it - Alan Wallbank, Geoff Braybrooke and Whetu Tirikatene Sullivan.. this Parliament will pass this Bill 63 to 30 something.. I’ll start a petition.. a million signatures.. we’ll stop the Bill in its tracks