Media ID   0223-AB    

Parliamentary debate (6 November 1985) on the second reading of the Homosexual Law Reform Bill, plus interviews with Alison Laurie and Pol McCann (2 November 1985), Noel Mosen (a self-declared ‘ex-gay’, 5 November 1985), John Steenhof, and various news reports on the collection of signatures for the Hay Petition

Unique ID



Alison Laurie, Eric Thornton, John Steenhof, Keith Hay, Noel Mosen, Norm Jones, Norm Jones, Pol McCann, Trevor Mallard, talkback callers, unidentified speakers

Related media



Source tape





6 November 1985, 2 November 1985, 5 November 1985



Parliament, Gay Broadcasting Collective (Access Radio Wellington), 2ZB Wellington, Commercial Radio



Parliament, Gay Broadcasting Collective (Access Radio Wellington), 2ZB Wellington, Commercial Radio

Recorded by


Barry Neels

Deposited by


Barry Neels


Parliamentary debate on the second reading spans 0213 – 0223, and 0206


This summary gives general themes as to the content of this recording. It is not a verbatim transcript. Always refer back to the original audio. This is a working document and any amendments/corrections are welcome.



Parliamentary debate (6 November 1985) on the second reading of the Homosexual Law Reform Bill



Norm Jones [first seven minutes are a repeat of 0222-AB] – Florida and AIDS.. 72,000 homosexuals from Cuba are in Florida.. I want to give notice of an Amendment that this Bill should lie on the table for twelve months.. the homosexual community thought that this Bill would get through this House in a few short weeks .. well here we are eight months later..



Jones – they didn’t anticipate the massive opposition to this Bill .. by the time this Bill gets through all of its stages .. this Bill will not pass in its present form.. I’ve been doing my counting .. 36 Members will vote against this at every stage.. sixteen years of age or nothing..



Jones – there has been an internationally organised campaign amongst the homosexuals.. if you’re criticising the petition.. the day this Bill passes.. the repeal referendum will start the very next day.. it won’t go away..



Jones – I’ve always seen both sides of the argument.. it’s either right or wrong.. it is wrong.. I’m no bible banging Christian.. I’ll go to my Lord on judgment day.. I use to chase women.. I never chased blokes.. church leaders judgment day.. it is no laughing matter.. AIDS.. internationally organized campaign.. homosexual disease AIDS.. homosexuals killing themselves with AIDS.. it was quite obvious to them that no Government was going to spend millions of dollars on a homosexual disease.. the only hope for the homosexuals was for the worlds blood banks to be contaminated with AIDS.. they deliberately fed this disease into the blood banks..



Barry Neels – the last few words were cut off.. but the Speaker was about to cut him off and then the House rose.



Part of Gay BC (2 November 1985 ?), Access Radio Wellington.. Alison Laurie interview



Who makes up the Coalition of Concerned Citizens..



Alison Laurie - Tait, Hay, Barry Reed, links with Richard Flinn, League of Rights



Laurie – they have a broad range of issues.. we must form coalitions with other repressed groups.. their next big issue is going to be the abortion issue and then sex education..



Petition supporter at Parliament (24 September 1985) - I am here to support the Bible.. Gods the only way.. Communism is going to take over..



The Jessels [Chris Knox, Flying Nun records] “The Worst Noel” .. God loves you..



Gay BC news – Brent and Vicki (?): the next and hopefully last debate on the second reading of the Homosexual Law Reform Bill will happen on Wednesday night.. AIDS research.. slim disease has been reported amongst heterosexuals in Uganda.. A French medical team has announced a degree of success in battling the AIDS virus – anti-rejection drug psychlosporin.. Soviet newspaper suggested that AIDS could be the result of CIA/Pentagon experiments.. Next Lesbian and Gay dance.. Victoria Club review.. Gay Task Force meeting on 3 November 1985



song from “Gay Men” (a French duo) .. I’m a man who needs a man.. I’m a gay man



Pol McCann talking about the gay student radio show in Dunedin.. we got a bit of flack from Christians..



Gay BC theme music



News item on the safety of the [Hepatitis B] vaccine



Dr Eric Thornton – [Hepatitis B] vaccine safe.. AIDS .. there isn’t a risk



Interview with Noel Mosen, a self-declared ‘ex-gay’ (5 November 1985) by Paul Holmes on 2ZB Wellington.. also present Reformed Church minister John Steenhof



Noel Mosen - my homosexuality began at an early age.. I was badly treated in a Children’s Home.. progression of hate towards women.. when I was adopted out I built up a relationship with my adoptive father.. the syndrome had begun..



Mosen – I was raped when I was seven-and-a-half.. when you’re emotionally unstable.. I saw this guy as wanting me.. I’ve seen him against since.. memories..



Mosen – I feel strongly for the gay community.. but we’ve been classed as fundamentalist bigots.. the homosexual community has a fundy phobia..



Mosen – by the age of twelve I started to fool around.. one night stands.. at twenty-one I found out who my father was.. I was adopted when I was one.. all homosexuals are promiscuous..



Mosen – the gay lifestyle is based on promiscuity.. my whole life revolved around sex.. my problems relate to my homosexuality..



Mosen – God gave me emotionally security.. I haven’t had sex for almost three years.. almost got married.. In the past three years I haven’t been attracted to another man.. I do not have sexual fantasies about men anymore



Mosen – I was placed in Oakley Hospital in Auckland for Gay Aversion Therapy.. one year.. shock treatment.. I was about fifteen/sixteen.. when they realised they couldn’t cure me they threw me out.. they sexually raped me..



Mosen – I condemn anyone who is a bigot.. I’ve restored my relationship with my parents..



Mosen – Emotionally, gays are disturbed.. suicides.. tried once before the age of fifteen.. counselling..



Paul Holmes – isn’t the worst thing in the world not accepting what you are..



Mosen – I am not a homosexual any longer.. I haven’t signed the petition .. but I might.. Gay Rights Coalition..



Rev John Steenhof - It’s a brave stance for Noel.. he said he’s felt like a traitor..



Caller: Male – We are not using Noel.. Noel came here last week with a former lesbian feminist..



Various news reports on the collection of signatures for the Hay Petition (ca 6 November 1985)



Trevor Mallard – report back of the Select Committee in Parliament



Trevor Mallard – tactics on expanding the number of signatures on the petition.. what will happen to the petition now..



Keith Hay – The way the petition was collected .. we were prepared to answer any of Trevor Mallard’s questions.. he has let us down.. I have a democratic right..



Trevor Mallard – (partial repeat of audio at 46:50).. back announce from newsreader: the second reading is due to be debated tonight..



Norm Jones – signatures on the petition.. we can produce another petition.. this issue is not going to go away..



John Steenhof – Concerned Citizens Coalition.. response to the petition report back .. the innuendo that the New Zealand people have been fooled by propaganda.. is just like calling the average New Zealander an unintelligent pawn.



? - Every elector will be approached to sign a petition to repeal this Bill