Media ID   0237-B    

Parliamentary Committee Stages (9 April 1986) of the Homosexual Law Reform Bill

Unique ID



Bill Sutton, Fran Wilde, Geoff Braybrooke, Geoffrey Palmer, Graeme Lee, John Banks, Merv Wellington, Michael Cullen, Norm Jones, Richard Northey, Robert Muldoon, Whetu Tirikatene Sullivan, Winston Peters

Related media

0237-A, 0237a-A


Source tape





9 April 1986







Recorded by


Barry Neels

Deposited by


Barry Neels


Committee Stages span 0231 – 0238


This summary gives general themes as to the content of this recording. It is not a verbatim transcript. Always refer back to the original audio. This is a working document and any amendments/corrections are welcome.



Debate continues on Part Two (anti discrimination)



Fran Wilde [continued from 0237-A] – Part Two ..discrimination.. there will still be freedom of speech..



Graeme Lee – point of order.. would you confirm that the speaking time is four times five minute calls.. In Part Two there are two clauses and nine amendments..



Michael Cullen - speaking to point of order..



Norm Jones – Part Two of this Bill amends the Human Rights Act.. If this Bill is not amended you’ll get leaders who are known homosexuals



Merv Wellington - point of order ..a press representative is infringing Standing Orders.. Mr Harman from Television New Zealand is imitating Norm Jones



Winston Peters – I made a face at Mr Harman.. If there is a guilty party



Geoffrey Palmer – speaking to point of order



Norm Jones – under the Bill’s definition of sexual orientation.. Man-boy homosexuality becomes lawful .. I cannot sack them.. all the homosexual perverts will be flying into .. twelve year old boys.. and if I discriminate against them I am having my rights violated.. if it’s legally right then it has got to be morally right..



Geoff Braybrooke – I oppose Part Two strongly.. we are trying to sanitize a gross indecency .. and now we are being told that we must not discriminate.. decent New Zealanders will not accept it..



John Banks – point of order..



Braybrooke – discrimination in our schools.. If we allow homosexual teachers to practise with their students.. I would like to introduce an SOP to exempt education, armed forces, police, traffic officers, penal institutions



Braybrooke – this Bill has divided New Zealand, families and churches.. Part Two is the most repugnant because it tells people how they should think



John Banks – Minister of Education has just arrived in the House.. sixteen year old boys with adult teachers.. this Parliament has legalised sodomy for sixteen year old boys.. and next year we will vote against 15.. 14.. It costs $2,600 per minute to run this House.. and for weeks we’ve been dealing with what age can young boys sodomize each other..



Banks – Part Two legitimises sodomy.. schools up and down the country can and must hire practising homosexuals.. promiscuity.. young boys need protection.. socially evil.. family unit stands to be crippled.. The Minister of Education has a lot to be answer for..



Richard Northey – Part two deals with sexual orientation and not behaviour.. most schools now have got rules.. Part Two is more widely supported.. discrimination should cease.. I’m pleased to support Part Two..



Whetu Tirikatene Sullivan -I rise to move an amendment to Part Two.. quote the German sociologist and homosexual Martin Dannecker – the faithful homosexual friendship is a myth.. the reality is that we are after many partners .. this amendment goes to continued discrimination in employment and in accommodation to those homosexuals who are predatory, promiscuous and sodomist.. 10% of homicides in San Francisco are the result of sadomasochistic homosexual practises.. my amendment seeks to protect parents..



Tirikatene Sullivan – when private homosexual behaviour offends other occupants of the same building it becomes a public affair.. it grants human rights to a minority.. and thereby removes the rights of the parents ..



Tirikatene Sullivan – I have advocated against unwarranted discrimination against an ethnic minority.. yet here I am arguing for discrimination against active homosexuals.. a real example – one of this woman’s sons was sodomized.. he was a boarder.. if this part of the Bill goes through she will not be able to discriminate.. she will be made an offender..



Robert Muldoon – fatal flaw in this Bill .. I am more opposed to this part of the Bill.. the act of the aggressive homosexual.. the parents, the family will have the fear .. but it will be an offence for them to discriminate.. Boy Scout movement.. It is my understanding that under this Bill the Boy Scout movement will not be able to enquire whether prospective leaders are homosexual..



Muldoon – boys schools.. is the Bill going to permit homosexuals as live-in Masters? Which is the greater right that is being infringed.. homosexual seduction..



Bill Sutton – [TAPE CUTS] .. [continues on 0237a-A]